Volume 47 Number 83
Produced: Tue May 3 21:19:41 EDT 2005
Subjects Discussed In This Issue:
Ana B'cho'ach
[Yisrael Medad]
Chametz after Pesach
[David Curwin]
Do no harm
[Carl Singer]
Eliyahu haNavi
[Prof. Aryeh Frimer]
Eretz
[Jack Gross]
Jews and England
[David Charlap]
Linguistic Question - Tzara'as
[Eitan Fiorino]
Pesach preparations
[Israel Caspi]
Pronunciation
[Perets Mett]
Proposed new US Daylight Savings Time Rules
[Ken Bloom]
Quinoa
[Orrin Tilevitz]
Tefillah b'tzibbur- any physical/medical limitations
[Martin Stern]
Ulchaparat Pasha
[Ed Goldstein]
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From: Yisrael Medad <ybmedad@...>
Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 20:42:42 +0200
Subject: Ana B'cho'ach
Brian Wiener points out an error in the Artscroll siddur at Kabbalat
Shabbat in Ana BeChoach, in the second line,
>'kabel rinat, am'cha sag'venu,'. Quite clearly, the comma should be
>after am'cha; 'kabel rinat am'cha, sag'venu'
it would seem so but I recall very, very vaguely that the poem is to be
recited always in two-word groups for a Kabbalistic reason. I will try
to check but maybe someone else heard that?
I also recall a story relating to Zalman Shazar, Israel's third
president. He was from a Chabad family before becoming a Halutz and
socialist but remained close and was a scholar of no small repute. The
story seems to have been one of a group, including Shazar, in some sort
of danger and he recited out loud Ana B'choach to ward off the threat
and it worked. Again, details are lacking but that's what this list is
for, no?
Yisrael Medad
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From: David Curwin <tobyndave@...>
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2005 12:11:19 +0200
Subject: Chametz after Pesach
Where I work, there is a coin operated dispenser of coated peanuts -
certainly chametz. Being that I work in Israel, both the owner of the
dispenser and all the workers are Jews, but not necessarily religious. I
have noticed that even on Pesach the container is still in the hall,
full of peanuts. It does not seem that the peanuts were sold to a
non-Jew before Pesach.
Now as much as I generally enjoy eating the peanuts, I can resist until
a new batch comes in, or otherwise wait a month as I believe the halacha
proscribes. But here's my question. If I wanted to help out my fellow
employees, and prevent them from eating this chametz that was not sold
on Pesach, I could theoretically buy all the rest of the peanuts and
throw them away. But would that be violating the "fine" that the owner
of the dispenser is supposed to receive? In other words, is it worse to
purchase chametz that wasn't sold on Pesach, or to eat it?
David Curwin
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From: Carl Singer <casinger@...>
Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 07:42:27 -0400
Subject: Do no harm
>> In medicine, I will not always tell a distraught mother that
>> she gave a disease to her baby, even if it is true; certainly not
>> right away.
> Any doctor who decides for himself in this way what information to
> reveal to, and what information to conceal from, his employers, is [in
> the author opinion] unfit to practice medicine, plain and simple, and
> should hand in his license, or have it taken from him.
I am not a physician.
Although neither the Greek or the "modern" Hippocratic Oath says "do no
harm" (The original has "I will keep them from harm and injustice.")
Withholding (temporarily?) information that would be psychologically
harmful to a person (the distraught Mother) certainly seems prudent.
The parallel to relevant Halacha is clear.
Carl Singer
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From: Prof. Aryeh Frimer <frimea@...>
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2005 12:07:09 +0200
Subject: Eliyahu haNavi
It is commonly believed that Eliyahu will or can come Seder night to
be Mevaser the Geulah (See Hok Yaakov to OH 480). In many circles
(particularly - though not exclusively - Hasidic circles) there is a
belief that Eliyahu visit every home seder night just as he comes to
every Brit. Eliyahu is greeted with Barukh HaBa.
However, the Gemara in Eruvin 43b makes it clear that, according to
the view that there are Techumin above 10, Eliyahu cannot come on
Shabbat or Yom Tov. The Gemara does not come to a clear ruling on this
matter and Le-halakha it is a safek. Are we forced to say that this
tradition that Eliyahu will/does or at least can come Seder night is
only according to the view that there aren't Techumin above 10.
See Turei Even on R"H 11a s.v. "Be-Tishrei". He deals with this
gemara - but he is focussed on the coming of Ben David (Mashiach). My
reading of the Turei Even is that indeed Ben David or Eliyahu will come
some time in Nissan but not Seder night. See also Mishnah Berurah, 480,
no. 10 - That Kos Eliyahu indicates that we believe he will come - but
he is noncommital regarding necessarily Seder night.
Has anyone seen any discussion of this point?
Hag Sameach
Dr. Aryeh A. Frimer
Chemistry Dept., Bar-Ilan University, Ramat Gan 52900, ISRAEL
E-mail: <FrimeA@...>
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From: Jack Gross <jbgross@...>
Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 08:57:33 -0400
Subject: Re: Eretz
From: "Jack Gross" <jbgross@...>
> Jay F Shachter wrote
>> ...How does the author of the above quote pronounce the last word of
>> the benediction over bread (which is clearly a reference to Psalms
>> 104:14 -- in which the pausal form of the word appears -- but not a
>> direct quote of that verse)?
> When the Heh prefix is attached, Eretz becomes Ha'Aretz (never
> Ha'Eretz). Nothing to do with position in the phrase or sentence.
> Consider "Me'Al Ha-aretz HaTovah", as a rather familar example.
Let me add that the unusual behavior of the noun "Eretz" is discussed by
Ibn Ezra to Gen. 1:2.
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From: David Charlap <shamino@...>
Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 15:21:31 -0400
Subject: Re: Jews and England
Carl Singer wrote:
> Interestingly (?) Shakespeare may never have met a Jew in his life time
> (1564-1616)
> Quoting from the internet http://www.historyofengland.net/judaism/
> England was the first country in Europe to expel Jews (1290) and under
> Oliver Cromwell (1656) the first country to welcome them back into an
> environment where they could live at peace with their neighbours for the
> first time for over 1000 years.
And, ironically, that very same web site perpetuates the anti-semetic
myth that Jesus was tried and sentenced to death by a Jewish court.
Such a thing could never have happened. Prior to the time of these
events (assuming they happened at all), the Sanhedrin had moved itself
away from Jerusalem. Without a Sanhedrin in Jerusalem, no death
sentence can be issued by any Jewish court.
Scholors who are aware of Jewish law know this. Unfortunately, the
editors of "historyofengland.net" either are unaware of this key fact,
or they have chosen to ignore it in favor of the more popular version as
told in the Christian bible (which they call the New Testament.) Either
way, it calls into question the accuracy of everything else they have to
say about Jews and Judaism.
-- David
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From: Eitan Fiorino <Fiorino@...>
Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 18:10:00 -0400
Subject: RE: Linguistic Question - Tzara'as
According to the dictionary psoriasis is derived from the Greek "psora"
which means "itch." Could the Greek have derived from the Hebrew, or
both from a common linguistic precedent? I suppose it is possible . . .
-Eitan
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From: Israel Caspi <icaspi@...>
Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2005 07:59:45 -0500
Subject: Pesach preparations
In reviewing the rules for Pesach preparation this year, the following
questions occurred to me (to which I don't know the answer):
1. Regarding all of the things that are done on Shabbat morning up
until the time for eating chametz -- cleaning up, disposing of the last
crumbs of chametz and the statement of biur chametz -- why aren't they
forbidden as preparation on Shabbat for the next day?
2. One of the recommended ways to dispose of the last crumbs of chametz
eaten on Shabbat is to flush them down the toilet. In an place where
there is no eruv, why is that not considered hotza'ah? (For that
matter, the same question exists on every Shabbat for flushing the
toilet or even just for running water which goes down the drain.)
--Israel Caspi
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From: Perets Mett <p.mett@...>
Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 11:25:48 +0100
Subject: Pronunciation
HS Snyder wrote:
> Whereas it is true that yitgadal v'yitkadash is grammatically proper in
> Hebrew, the change to the tzeirei makes the distinction clearer. In my
> opinion, the reason that changes are not made in yitbarach v'yishtabach
> v'yitpa'ar v'yitromam is because these words are found in that form in
> other prayers. If they were changed in the kaddish it might imply the
> necessity to change elsewhere. Can you imagine saying "Start at
> yishtabeah", for example?
>
No, because yishtabach is perfectly good Hebrew.
cf yeshalach, yesamach
Perets Mett
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From: Ken Bloom <kabloom@...>
Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2005 08:55:47 -0700
Subject: Proposed new US Daylight Savings Time Rules
I was reading in the newspaper this morning that the US House of
Representantives passed a very important energy bill. One of the
provisions of the bill is to expand Daylight Savings Time to run from
early March to late November. (Here's a link to the article on MSNBC
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/7599782/ ). The US Senate still hasn't passed
this bill yet.
To get an idea of what they're proposing (and how it will affect
Shacharit), here's an example of the new zmanim:
On Sunday March 6, 2005 (which would probably be the the new date of the
clock change -- I didn't look hard to find the new date), the Zmanim were:
San Francisco Monsey, NY
16.1deg Alot HaShachar 5:16 am 5:01 am
11 deg Mesheyakir 5:42 am 5:29 am
Netz 6:34 am 6:23 am
. . .
Shkiah 6:08 pm 5:52 pm
8.5deg Tzait HaChochavim 6:47 pm 6:33 pm
Under the new system, these times would be:
16.1deg Alot HaShachar 6:16 am 6:01 am
11 deg Mesheyakir 6:42 am 6:29 am
Netz 7:34 am 7:23 am
. . .
Shkiah 7:08 pm 6:52 pm
8.5deg Tzait HaChochavim 7:47 pm 7:33 pm
On April 3, 2005, the current start date for Daylight Savings Time, Netz
was at 6:52 am 6:36 am
On Saturday November 26, 2005 (which would probably be the last day of
Daylight Savings Time under the new system), the zmanim according to the
current system will be:
16.1deg Alot HaShachar 5:38 am 5:29 am
11 deg Mesheyakir 6:05 am 5:57 am
Netz 7:01 am 6:56 am
. . .
Shkiah 4:52 pm 4:30 pm
8.5deg Tzait HaChochavim 5:34 pm 5:14 pm
Under the new system:
16.1deg Alot HaShachar 6:38 am 6:29 am
11 deg Mesheyakir 7:05 am 6:57 am
Netz 8:01 am 7:56 am
. . .
Shkiah 5:52 pm 5:30 pm
8.5deg Tzait HaChochavim 6:34 pm 6:14 pm
These new times look like they will be rather inconvenient for
Shacharit. The weekday minyanim I usually make it to run from 6:30 or
6:45 in the morning until about 7:30. In November, it won't even be time
to put on our talitot until halfway through minyan.
So there are a couple questions. What can halachically be done of the US
Senate passes this bill and it becomes law? Is it necessary to write to
our Senators to request that they remove this provision from the bill?
Chag kasher v'sameach
--Ken Bloom
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From: Orrin Tilevitz <tilevitzo@...>
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2005 07:24:55 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Quinoa
1. According to the Chicago Rabbinical Council, quinoa sold in the
U.S. is processed, i.e., toasted. Therefore, it presents chametz
concerns if the plant processes chametz. Only 2 brands do not present
these concerns; the plant in which they are produced produces nothing
but quinoa.
2. The package directions on this product, from this plant, do not
instruct that the quinoa be washed, and contrary to another post, I have
never encountered soapy-tasting quinoa.
3. Also according to the CRC, a machlokes has developed over whether
quinoa is kitniyos. For this year, the CRC is standing by its policy
that quinoa is not kkitniyos, but the CRC will reevaluate the issue
after pesach.
Orrin Tilevitz
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From: Martin Stern <md.stern@...>
Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 11:53:54 +0100
Subject: Re: Tefillah b'tzibbur- any physical/medical limitations
on 21/4/05 10:10 am, <MSDratch@...> (M Dratch) wrote:
> In response to Carl Singer
> "I don't know the halachic source sited, but I was at a minyan where one
> of the lay leaders (someone with smicha -- but the not the shul's Rabbi
> who was not present at mincha / ma'ariv) stated that plony could not
> daven for the amud because he stammered badly when davening."
>
> See R. Meir of Rothenberg, Teshuvot Pesakim u-Minhagim I, 53:
>
> It is better if the Prayer-Reader is deformed. God is not like a king
> of flesh and blood who uses whole vessels and throws away those that are
> broken. God prefers broken vessels, as the Psalmist declares, "A
> broken heart and a contrite heart, O God, Thou will not despise."
> (Ps. 51:19)
With all due respect to M. Dratch, I think that this is not to the
point. The problem Carl was alluding to was where the person had a
speech defect which made it difficult for him to enunciate the prayers
and, furthermore, would have disturbed the congregation if he tried,
quite apart from considerably extending the time taken which might be a
serious problem on a weekday. On the other hand, that someone might have
some other physical deformity should not affect his ability to say them,
which is what Maharam Rothenberg is implying. Since one does not have to
look at him, his deformity should not be a distraction.
Martin Stern
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From: <bernieavi@...> (Ed Goldstein)
Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2005 09:07:24 -0400
Subject: Re: Ulchaparat Pasha
I was taught that in a leap year ulchaparat pasha is not said during
Nisan and later since the ibbur took place. Apparently it is in
anticipation of the ibbur occurring, even though now that is fixed.
Rabbi Ed Goldstein Woodmere NY
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End of Volume 47 Issue 83
