Volume 54 Number 65
Produced: Wed May 9 6:19:38 EDT 2007
Subjects Discussed In This Issue:
Bowing for Shabbat
[Ben Katz]
Corporal punishment
[Dr. Josh Backon]
Efficiency of the Shiddach System (2)
[Janice Gelb, Perets Mett]
Kalba and Pesach (meat and milk pet food)
[Dr. Josh Backon]
Lag Ba'Omer Parade and Celebration (2)
[SBA, Jacob Richman]
Parsha Shiur with Rabbi Brovender
[Jeffrey Saks]
Psychologist resources for sexual issues for religious patients (3)
[Jeremy Rose, Akiva Miller, Alan Goldberg]
Turning for L'Cha Dodi
[David Taragin]
Unmarried women and kippot?
[Dr. Josh Backon]
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From: Ben Katz <bkatz@...>
Date: Tue, 08 May 2007 10:01:13 -0500
Subject: Re: Bowing for Shabbat
>From: Irwin E. Weiss, Esquire <irwin@...>
>Marilyn Tomsky wrote regarding the practice of standing up and bowing
>toward the door to welcome Shabbat, saying that she did not grow up with
>this minhag.
>[snip]
>I have seen this for Kabbalat Shabbat at the Kotel, even though there is
>no physical rear door.
I don't think a door has anything to do with the origin of the minhag.
I am sure some shuls had doors on the side and yet we always face the
back.
According to Rabbi Dr. Sperber, because the sun sets in the west, the
new day is thought to arise in the west, and thus the west is the
direction from which shabat "comes from" friday eve. in tzefat where
kabalat shabat originated, people davened outside an would turn west.
when shuls were built, since they usually faced east, we turn to the
back to greet our newly arrived guest. that being said, as i write this
i am unsure what is done in israel in shuls that do not face east.
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From: Dr. Josh Backon <backon@...>
Date: Tue, 08 May 2007 12:47:30 +0300
Subject: Re: Corporal punishment
>Russell Jay Hendel wrote:
> > IN ALL legal systems parents have a right to hit their children.
While classical Jewish sources permit chastising one's child (Midrash
Rabba Shemot) there were severe limits (MEIRI Bava Batra 21a) such as
only using a very light strap and hitting very gently, not hitting one's
child in the month of Tamuz. The RITVA (Moed Kattan 17a) recommended
that a parent verbally reprimand rather than hit. The Shulchan Aruch
YOREH DEAH (Hilchot Melamdim) Siman 245:10 delineates the permitted
parameters of a teacher giving corporal punishment to a pupil. A teacher
who physically abuses a pupil can be dismissed (the MEIRI in Bava Batra
21a calls this abuse a "peshia" [major offense]. See also the Pitchei
Tshuva YD 245 #4. The Nishmat Avraham CHOSHEN MISHPAT 424 # 2 brings
down the opinion of Harav Rabinovitz (Sefer Halacha u'Refuah I 336) that
a parent (and teacher) who hits out of anger not for "educational"
purposes, or has severely hit his child even for the sake of *chinuch*
(education) has carried out an *aveira* (sin). One is halachically
required to report the abusive parent (teacher) to the police.
Josh Backon
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From: Janice Gelb <j_gelb@...>
Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 04:11:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Efficiency of the Shiddach System
Ari Trachtenberg <trachten@...> wrote:
> As I understand it, Chasidic thought teaches that choosing your spouse
> is the ultimate unreasonable act, done based on poorly defined
> measures (e.g. why do you like this person rather than that one?) much
> like G-d's choosing of Israel. In this case, there is no significant
> difference between 5-10 minutes (and some perfunctory background
> checks) and several years ...
Not necessarily true. Even if ultimately the act of choosing a spouse is
made partially on illogical and indefinable factors, knowing the person
longer can at least enable you to gather more information about the
person, which (a) helps you decide in those areas that *are* subject to
logic (e.g., the person's attitude toward family, goals in life, etc.),
and (b) provides more input to whatever area of your subconscious helps
you make the choice ultimately.
I think that it's possible perhaps to know within a relatively brief
period of time that a person is *not* compatible but I think that the
more information one has the better when trying to choose among those
who are possibilities.
-- Janice
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From: Perets Mett <p.mett@...>
Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 12:07:56 +0100
Subject: Re: Efficiency of the Shiddach System
From: Dov Bloom <dovb@...>
> Anyone who decides a question which is the most important decision of
> their LIFE after 5-10 minutes of meeting a stranger in my opinion
> needs their priorities or their heads examined. What can I say about
> anyone party to or supporting such a system???
The number of minutes, be they 10 (very rare), 100 or 1000 are not the
key factor. Who is to to say that marriages entered in to after dating
for six months (or two years) are any happier than those contracted
after meeting once or twice? It all depends on the context and milieu.
Ari commented:
> As I understand it, Chasidic thought teaches that choosing your spouse
> is the ultimate unreasonable act, done based on poorly defined
> measures (e.g. why do you like this person rather than that one?) much
> like G-d's choosing of Israel. In this case, there is no significant
> difference between 5-10 minutes (and some perfunctory background
> checks) and several years ...
The background checks are anything but perfunctory. They can be both
exhaustive and exhausting!
As Ari says, entering into a marriage contract is the same act of faith
and commitment, however long one has known the partner (and however well
too).
Perets Mett
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From: Dr. Josh Backon <backon@...>
Date: Tue, 08 May 2007 12:52:58 +0300
Subject: Re: Kalba and Pesach (meat and milk pet food)
>Why should one not be allowed to feed ones pets pet food with milk and
>meat ingredients? IIRC In America the meat that goes into pet food is
>treif and so what issur of Basar veHalav is there?
>
>See Rambam Maachalot Asurot Chapter 9 sections 2 and 4. See also YD 87:3
>and mefarshim there that there is only an issur hana'a if the 2 elements
>are eatable by themselves, but lets say pork and milk would not be assur
>behana'a. See Oruch Hashulchan 87:12 who explains the Rambam.
>
>My reading: there is no issur hana'a on basar bechalav pet food unless
>it is made with kosher meat. Certainly pork or dairy plus milk products
>should be OK.
See the Mishbetzot Zahav (Yoreh Deah 84 s"k 2) that the issur hana'a
(prohibition to derive benefit) and issur bishul is on the level of a
Toraitic prohibition (d'oraita) also for neveila (a kosher animal like
beef that was killed but not shechted) cooked with milk.See also the Pri
Megadim (mavo l'hilchot basar v'chalav) that there is an issur hana'ah
of basar neveila b'chalav. See the Pitchei Tshuva there 87 #6. See also
the Dagul Mei'revava there that there is an Issur D'oraita to cook
neveila (of a kosher animal like beef) with milk (from a kosher animal).
The halachic concept of "ein issur chal al issur" (something forbidden
can't receive a 2nd prohibition) is discussed in the gemara in Kiddushin
77b. From understanding the rishonim on this gemara, we see there are
some exceptions to this rule: issur mosif (2nd prohibition is a
different type than that of the first or engenders a more severe
punishment), issur kollel (the new prohibition forbids additional or
other items), and issur b'vat achat (both prohibitions occur
simultaneously).
IMHO, deriving benefit from neveila cooked in milk doesn't fall under
the rubric of "ein issur chal al issur" since conceptually it is "issur
mosif". The only Rishon who disagrees is the Rambam (Peyrush haMishnayot
to Kritut 3:4).
PEYRUSH RASHI: you can't feed your dog Irving (or Bonzo) pet food that
has nonkosher meat that has been cooked in milk. Instead, give it a nice
piece of homemade kishke :-) Then you'll wind up with the following
joke:
Moishe takes his dog to shul. The rabbi is furious. Moishe says, "My dog
knows how to daaven!". The dog puts on a Tallit, takes a siddur, starts
"shukling", and with tremendous kavana and a chazzanishe niggun starts
an amazing cantorial rendition. The rabbi is flabbergasted: "You can go
on TV, appear on Broadway, make movies in Hollywood, earn millions of
dollars!!". Moishe replies, "You convince him, he wants to SIT AND
LEARN". [The other version is "He wants to go to dental school!"]
And while on pets, here's another one:
Someone enters a pet store and sees a parrot with a sales price of
$10,000. The customer asks why and the store owner says, "This parrot
knows all of the Rambam and Shas by heart". Then the customer sees a
parrot with a sales price of $15,000. The customer asks why and the
owner says, "This parrot knows all of gemara, rishonim and the Shulchan
Aruch by heart". Then the customer sees this beautiful parrot way in the
back with a sales price of $250,000. The customer asks why and the owner
says, "To tell you the truth, I don't know. But the two parrots you saw
call him Rebbe !!!" :-)
Josh Backon
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From: SBA <areivim@...>
Date: Wed, 9 May 2007 00:49:43 +1000
Subject: Lag Ba'Omer Parade and Celebration
From: Jacob Richman <>
> On Sunday, May 6, there was a Lag Ba'Omer parade / celebration in
> Ma'aleh Adumim. ..sponsored by Chabad of Ma'aleh Adumim, included an
> acrobatics / juggling show....I was "volunteered" to participate in
> the "cut the carrot in the mouth/sword throw" and a balloon / fire
> torch stunt.
And the connection between carrots, balloons and Reb Shimon ben Yochai
is...
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From: Jacob Richman <jrichman@...>
Date: Wed, 09 May 2007 04:46:34 +0300
Subject: Re: Lag Ba'Omer Parade and Celebration
It was part of the entertainment for the kids. There were educational
stories and quizes about Lag Ba'Omer before and after the juggling acts.
Jacob
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From: Jeffrey Saks <atid@...>
Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 12:19:07 +0300
Subject: Parsha Shiur with Rabbi Brovender
ATID and Kehillat Shir Hadash are pleased to invite lovers of Torah to a
weekly Parsha Shiur in English with Rabbi Chaim Brovender. Thursday
evenings from 8:00 - 9:00 PM (followed by Maariv) at Shir Hadash, 4 Hayl
Nashim Street, Jerusalem (for map, click here:
http://tinyurl.com/2sntfb). The shiur is open to men and women. Please
bring a Humash with Rashi. To receive the source sheets for the weekly
shiur in advance, subscribe to <rcb-shiur-subscribe@...> For
details, contact ATID at 02-567-1719 or <atid@...>
Rabbi Brovender is marking the 40th anniversary of his teaching Torah in
Israel. For details on the special tribute in his honor on June 12,
visit: www.atid.org
Rabbi Jeffrey Saks, ATID
Rabbi Ian Pear, Shir Hadash
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From: Jeremy Rose <jeremy@...>
Date: Tue, 08 May 2007 11:01:34 +0100
Subject: Psychologist resources for sexual issues for religious patients
You should probably take a look at "Handbook of Psychotherapy and Jewish
Ethics: Halakhic Perspectives on Professional Values and Techniques", by
Moshe Halevi Spero. Available on Amazon - but somewhat inflated prices
for used copies. Your local library should be able to get one, though.
Jeremy L Rose
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From: Akiva Miller <kennethgmiller@...>
Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 10:53:59 GMT
Subject: Re: Psychologist resources for sexual issues for religious patients
Yossi Ginzberg wrote:
> Ergo, my response to the above: Since he says he is non- religious
> anyway, would it not be better for him to remain ignorant of the
> halacha? That way he will be free to do the therapeutically correct
> thing, which he presumably would anyway, but without becoming a
> "mazid" (purposeful violator of halacha).
I can see where this approach would be useful, but there are others
where it would not. For example, in many cases, the patient's problem
could be related to the friction between the patient's desires and the
patient's Torah feelings (be they guilt over his sins, or his sense of
obligation towards his spouse, or whatever). I cannot imagine how any
therapist or doctor could deal with such problems without at least a
basic understanding of where the patient is "coming from", and I think
that this is what that doctor had been asking for.
Akiva Miller
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From: Alan Goldberg <agoldbergphd@...>
Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 13:39:29 -0400
Subject: RE: Psychologist resources for sexual issues for religious patients
Joseph Ginzberg wrote:
> Ergo, my response to the above: Since he says he is non-religious
> anyway, would it not be better for him to remain ignorant of the
> halacha? That way he will be free to do the therapeutically correct
> thing, which he presumably would anyway, but without becoming a
> "mazid" (purposeful violator of halacha).
Joseph - thanks for the reply.
Yes, I can remain ignorant :)
But, my Orthodox clientele now mandates that I be aware, hence my
request for information.
It is someone odd, sexual issues are an issue for so many physiological,
physical, psychological, emotional issues, and more in the Orthodox
world. Yet they get no airplay, as opposed to issues such as the
Neturay Karta.
Al
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From: <dtaragin@...> (David Taragin)
Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 10:12:34 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Turning for L'Cha Dodi
This is more of a sociological observation rather than an halachic
question: I have noted often that in Shuls where the door is not in the
rear of the shul, but near the front, everybody seems to turn around and
face the rear anyway and bow to greet the Malka, even though she is
probably entering from the front. I guess this another example of
people doing something they are accustomed to doing before thinking
about what they are actually doing.
David Taragin
Silver Spring, MD
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From: Dr. Josh Backon <backon@...>
Date: Tue, 08 May 2007 12:44:48 +0300
Subject: Re: Unmarried women and kippot?
>Does know of teshuvot that discuss women (either unmarried women or
>married women in private) wearing kippot or otherwise covering their
>head when davening and making berachot? (Particularly in light of the
>practice of Conservative and Reform Jews in this regard.)
A woman (in private) who is nude isn't permitted to make a bracha or
pray (Aruch haShulchan ORACH CHAYIM 74 # 16). [BTW water in a mikva is
considered "covering" (AH OC 74 #12) and that's why women can make the
bracha on Tevilla in a mikva while nude but in the water]. Since "gilui
rosh" (uncovered hair) in a married woman isn't *erva* (something lewd)
due to the laxity of women who don't cover their hair (which is actually
required to prevent "periat ha'rosh") as per the Aruch haShulchan OC 75
#7, I find it hard to imagine that "kisui rosh" (headcovering) is
required by women for making a bracha or praying while fully dressed.
Josh Backon
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End of Volume 54 Issue 65
