Volume 30 Number 34 Produced: Wed Dec 15 5:39:04 US/Eastern 1999 Subjects Discussed In This Issue: (Rav) Eliezer or Elazar [Mordechai] Helping Children with Gemorah [Nosson Tuttle] Kriah of Ma'aseh Reuvein (3) [Art Werschulz, Richard Schultz, Joshua Jacobson] Pilegash, Aliyos [Israel Rubin] Policy on Attending Girl's Basketball Games? [Etan Diamond] Previous generations [David Deutsch] Writing and Commentary (30:31) [Myron Chaitovsky] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mordechai <Phyllostac@...> Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 11:30:07 EST Subject: (Rav) Eliezer or Elazar I have been perplexed for some time now about a matter related to the name of a famous Rosh Yeshiva (Rav E.Schach, shlit"a of the Ponovezh Yeshiva now in Bnei Brak, Israel). His name appears to be Elazar [and appears as such on his official stationary - where his name is printed as Rav Elazar Menachem Man Schach] (as in one of the sons of Aharon haCohen) - but very often (perhaps more than Elazar) he is referred to as Rabbi Eliezer Schach! Can people not tell the difference between Eliezer and Elazar? They are two different / distinct names! Even more puzzling to me is, when in one and the same publication, he is referred to as both Eliezer and Elazar.This is the case in a recent English book of his stories issued by a large Judaica publisher. Forgive me, but can they not make up their mind what his name correctly is? This has been bothering me for some time. I have brought this up with people, but am still troubled by the lack of what seems an adequate explanation. Do other people with the name Elazar get mistakenly called Eliezer to such a large degree? For some reason I think not. Can someone out there in Cyberia perhaps shed some light on the matter for me? Thanks in advance. I await your responses. Mordechai ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nosson Tuttle <TUTTLE@...> Date: 29 Nov 1999 00:24:43 -0000 Subject: Re: Helping Children with Gemorah >From: Aviva Fee <aviva613@...> >We have a friend who has what seems to be not so unique situation. >He is a baal teshuva whose oldest son is now in his second year of >learning gemorah (Talmud). Unfortunately, the father never had a chance >to learn in yeshiva, and hence, his mastery of gemorah is limited. His >son is coming home with gemorah homework and the father is extremely >frustrated that he is unable to assist his son. >The father is downcast that while he is working on his own gemorah >skills,. he will not be able to assist his son fully. Any ideas on how >to assist him in this situation? It is ironic that the very reforms which Rabbi Yehoshua ben Gamla instituted (to replace homeschooling by Yeshiva learning) in order to equalize educational disparities are being undermined by current tendencies in the Frum world for parents to feel responsible to help complete their children's homework. I have noticed this trend by seeing it here and also in the Jewish Press, which mentioned a suggestion for schools to give less homework because parents were spending too much time helping their children complete it! I do recall my parents insisting I finish homework but do not recall them helping me with it unless I needed ideas for reports or somebody to read an essay I had written. I do not think the fact that my parents are Reform Jews or that I went to public school should make my situation that different from that of homework given from Yeshivas to typical students. In the context in which the above reform of establishing Yeshiva education was made, it was still understood that the Mitzvah for a father to teach his son Torah was not being replaced but supplemented by this Yeshiva education. Certainly the Mitzvah of a father to learn with his son is still present under the Mitzvos Ha-av Al Haben (commandments for a father regarding his son). However, between the Yeshiva schedule and other commitments for both the father and son, the amount of time available for these sessions, and certainly the quality of information exchanged, differ from family to family. If students in a class are required to "Chazer" (practice) over a particular Shiur in preparation for that class, the best way for them to achieve that practice is to go over the material with a Chavrusa (partner) who takes that same class in school. The father can almost be on that level if he is familiar with that Gemara, but he cannot be expected to detail the points which have been emphasized by that particular Rebbe (it is very interesting that the process of learning with one's children will often be more instructive for the parents who will learn new ways to look at the material and also brush up on things that they had forgotten!). Here it may also be pointed out in the context of the above two paragraphs that an out-of-town Yeshiva where the children stay overnight and board at the Yeshiva or with families local to the Yeshiva does not give much chance for the above-mentioned father-son interaction in learning, but also minimizes the deficiencies of one parent relative to another (which was the reason why the Yeshiva-concept was introduced for children). -Nosson Tuttle ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Art Werschulz <agw@...> Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 09:06:27 -0500 (EST) Subject: Kriah of Ma'aseh Reuvein Hi. Eliezer Appleton <eappleto@...> wrote: > I'm looking for sources on the correct way to read ma'aseh Reuvein - > Bereishis 35:22. Should it be read as one pasuk or two? In either > case, what would be the correct trop on each word? According to Tikkun Kor'im Simanim, it's read as one pasuk, as follows: vayelech Reuven munach revia vayishkav pashta et-Bilhah pashta pilegesh aviv munach zakeif-katon vayishma tipcha Yisrael etnachta vayihyu mercha vnei-Yaakov tipcha sh'neim mercha asar sof-pasuk > Why is there a piska be'emtza pasuk here? According to the Hertz Chumash: "This means that the subject is abruptly dropped; it being too distasteful to continue so revolting a theme." Chodesh tov, Chag Urim Sameach, and ADVshabbatshalomANCE. -- Art Werschulz (8-{)} "Metaphors be with you." -- bumper sticker GCS/M (GAT): d? -p+ c++ l u+(-) e--- m* s n+ h f g+ w+ t++ r- y? Internet: <agw@...><a href="http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~agw/">WWW</a> ATTnet: Columbia U. (212) 939-7061, Fordham U. (212) 636-6325 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Schultz <schultr@...> Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 09:29:38 +0200 Subject: Kriah of Ma'aseh Reuvein For the public reading, it is read as a single pasuk. For the "out loud" reading, the ta`amim are Reuvein -- revi'i vayyishkav -- pashta et-bilhah -- pashta pilegesh -- munach aviv -- zaqef katan (This is taken from the masoretic notes to the Miqra'ot Gedolot) : Are there different minhagim? To the best of my knowledge, no. : Why is there a piska be'emtza pasuk here? Someone more knowledgable than I can probably give you a better answer, but to the best of my knowledge, it is because the subject of Reuvein's actions is simply dropped without any continuation, and a completely new subject taken up. : How far back historically can we trace this break and the double set : of trop? The break goes back at least to the Talmudic period; in massechet Megillah (25b IIRC) the mishnah says that the incident of Reuvein and Bilhah is not translated [into Aramaic] by the meturgeman [who used to translate the Torah as it was read]. The Gemara comments that the second half of that verse *is* translated. The double set of ta`amim goes back at least to the earliest Masoretic manuscripts -- it is already found in the Leningrad MS, which is the oldest complete manuscript of the Tanach. Richard Schultz <schultr@...> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joshua Jacobson <JRJ4859@...> Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 08:18:41 EST Subject: Re: Kriah of Ma'aseh Reuvein High and Low Accents, The Saga of Reuben Various explanations have been offered for the unusual punctuation of "the saga of Reuben" in Genesis 35:22. Why are there two different te'amim on five of the words? According to one tradition the word Yisrael is punctuated with etnahta. Why then is there a paragraph break in the middle of this sentence? An early rabbinic exegesis explains that even though Yisra'el (Jacob) heard about Reuben's immoral deed, he did not disown his son; Reuben is still numbered among Jacob's twelve children in the same verse as his crime is related. On the other hand, some modern Biblical scholars speculate that a paragraph ending with an unfinished sentence indicates the excision of several words by the hand of an early editor. The missing words do appear in the Septuagint. In this ancient Greek translation the verse reads. "And while Israel dwelt in that land, Reuben went and lay with Balla the concubine of his father Jacob, and Israel heard of it,{ and it appeared evil in his sight.}" The italicized words [Italics do not transfer well over the general email systems, although there are more today which do maintain font formating, many still do not, so I have replaced the italics with {}'s. Mod.] are the phrase that is missing in the Masoretic text. According to another tradition the word Yisrael is punctuated with siluk. This punctuation allows the paragraph to end with a complete sentence. While Wickes opines that this is the original punctuation, others see the hand of a later editor attempting to smooth over an expurgated text. According to Breuer, the punctuation as a single verse is the high cantillation and the punctuation as two verses is the low cantillation. When reading this passage as part of the synagogue liturgy in the pericope of Vayyishlah, the ba'al keri'ah utilizes the punctuation as a single verse. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Israel Rubin <Israel.Rubin@...> Date: Thu Oct 28 15:53:36 1999 Subject: Re: Pilegash, Aliyos Zvi Weiss writes (#92) quoting a Rav Yosef Shani that "[in] a pilegesh relationship, the woman is "equal" to the man". I'm not sure exactly what is meant by this, but it should noted, in discussing the issue of pilegesh, that it is very clear from many sources in Chazal & the Rishonim that the relationship of a pilegesh was that of a servant/wife, far lower in status than an actual wife. There has been much discussion in recent issues about the topic of using titles when calling someone up to the Torah. Since the discussion was triggered by someone mentioning an incident in which an unmarried man in his forties had his feelings hurt by being called up as "habochur", I would like to note that there's no reason not to call such a person up as "harav". I am usually the gabbai in the shul in which I daven, and I would call up anyone over 30 as harav - maybe even younger. More on this issue - I recall someone telling me that Sefardim don't actually call people up to the Torah in the manner of Ashkenazim, but simply approach the person and tell him that he is getting the current aliya. Also, I believe that in Breur's Shul in Washington Heights, there are metal ornaments with the names of the aliyas (shlishi, revi'i etc.) engraved on them, which are given to the intended recipients of those aliyas. I would qualify, however, that I don't know either of these facts firsthand. Perhaps someone who does could enlighten us further. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Etan Diamond <ediamond@...> Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 09:03:24 -0000 Subject: Policy on Attending Girl's Basketball Games? Do the day schools or high schools in your area have a policy about fathers and brothers attending girls basketball games? (This question assumes that there are day schools and high schools that have girls basketball teams.) Do they have policies for the other side--mothers and sisters attending boys games? Is prohibiting dads and brothers from coming to watch their daughters and sisters altogether (for religious modesty reasons) a better solution than not letting the girls play interschool games in the first place. One could argue that you are letting them play anyways, why should you deprive the parents and siblings from seeing their daughters and sisters compete? Does keeping the fathers and brothers away stigmatize the girls in some way, particularly if the prohibition does not extend to the other way (keeping mothers and sisters away from the boys' games)? Thanks. Etan Diamond, Ph.D. <ediamond@...> The Polis Center (317) 274-3836 1200 Waterway Blvd., Suite 100 (317) 278-1830 (fax) Indianapolis, IN 46202 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: David Deutsch <dsd3543@...> Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 12:34:21 -0000 Subject: Previous generations Meir Shinnar <meir_shinnar@...> wrote >I am told that Artscroll, in republishing family photographs, had to >airbrush sheitels into the pictures not to scandalize today's crowd Perhaps Artscroll would like to comment on this allegation which I would venture to suggest borders on the libellous. Besides, any argument which is supported by a statement of this nature is seriously undermined. David Deutsch [If anyone on the list has any connections to Artscroll and can get a reply from them, I would be happy to publish it on the list. Mod] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Myron Chaitovsky <MCHAIT@...> Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 10:24:00 -0500 Subject: Writing and Commentary (30:31) Ms Franco's dismissal of mesorah / mekorot ["I don't take the sources seriously"] would seem to make any of our responses useless to her. After all, why care? But assuming that she was either too hasty, too glib, or badly edited , it would seem IMHO that the two pitfalls to be aware of in utilizing a source ( beyond accurately quoting it,of course) is to determine if the statement is (a) normative and (b) complete. Thus, as to (a), citing a minority opinion which is clearly rejected by the Sages ( and not, then, for the initiated, an eilu v'eilu situation), or otherwise dismissed by later normative halacha as not to be followed, would be misleading and therefore a disservice to Ms Franco's readers. An oft-violated example of (b) is the story of the gentile who sought a quickie conversion. Rejected outright by the Tanna , Shammai, the would-be convert turned instead to Shammai's contemporary and halachic "opponent" , Hillel. As is well known, Hillel summed up all of Judaism into one pithy saying, suitable for any ecumenical gathering or Social Actions Committee. What is generally lost in the re-telling is that after Hillel did so he gave an important charge to the gentile: Go Study. Leaving out the "punchline" may yet make for a great story, but reduces the actual teaching into something less than it is. As with a misguided dependence on spell-check, the words in the quote may be accurate, but the meaning behind the phrase has been lost, sometimes irretrievably. Myron B. Chaitovsky Director of Admissions Brooklyn Law School ----------------------------------------------------------------------
End of Volume 30 Issue 34