Volume 42 Number 93
Produced: Tue Jun 8 7:53:12 US/Eastern 2004
Subjects Discussed In This Issue:
Bameh Madlikin and Hassidic custom
[Gershon Dubin]
Biblical Source for Duchaning Everyday
[David Cohen]
Duchaning Every Day
[Benschar, Tal S.]
Duchening on Shabbos Yom Tov
[Alan Friedenberg]
Kabbalah and Halacha
[Martin Stern]
Marrying someone with your mother's name? (2)
[Art Werschulz, Ken Bloom]
North, south, left and right (was: Yemenite and Ashkenaz nusach)
[Mike Gerver]
Not Duchaning on Shabbat (3)
[Chaim Tatel, Kenneth G Miller, Yakir]
Tefilah Nusach
[Mark Steiner]
What "Counts" as Tzedakah
[Gershon Dubin]
Yemenite and Ashkenaz nusach
[Gilad J. Gevaryahu]
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: <gershon.dubin@...> (Gershon Dubin)
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 13:13:37 -0400
Subject: Bameh Madlikin and Hassidic custom
In one of the local shuls here in Flatbush, nusach sefarad, they say
bameh madlikin and kegavna.
Gershon
<gershon.dubin@...>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: David Cohen <ddcohen@...>
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 08:47:26 -0400
Subject: Biblical Source for Duchaning Everyday
Regarding the Ashkenazi custom of not dukhaning every day, Avi Feldblum
wrote:
> I think it is far from clear that kabbalistic reasoning has not
> abrogated normative halacha in a number of places. I consider this to
> one of those cases.
I definitely agree that this is the case in a number of places, but
there is usually some evidence that minhag Ashkenaz was originally
different, before the rise in influence of kabbalah. Is there any
evidence that they dukhaned every day in early Ashkenaz?
--D.C.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Benschar, Tal S. <tbenschar@...>
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 12:46:54 -0400
Subject: Duchaning Every Day
I believe there is a Rambam which states that whenever there is a
positive commandment with no specific time then at minimum one must
fulfill the mitzvah at least once a day. That is the case for tefillin
and prayer (on a Torah level) and similarly that should be the case for
duchaning -- a Torah obligation with no set time, therefore should be
performed at least once a day.
(Parenthetically, we should also duchan at Minchah, except that we are
worried that he Cohanim may have drunk in the meantime and not be
allowed to duchan. On a fast day, when there is no such worry, then
most nuschaos have duchaning in the last brachah, and indeed in Israel
the Cohanim duchan at Minchah on a fast day. In fact, on Yom Kippur,
they duchan four times: Shacharis, Musaf, Minchah and Neilah. Likewise,
on Shabbos and Yom Tov, duchaning is at both Shacharis and Musaf)
This of course begs the question of how Minhag Ashkenaz can nullify a
Torah obligation. The answer I heard in a shiur is that the obligation
on the Cohanim only begins when they are called to duchan, which we
learn from the phrase "Amor Lahem." The minhag is simply not to call
the Cohanim to duchan.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Alan Friedenberg <elshpen@...>
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 04:57:23 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Duchening on Shabbos Yom Tov
The shule where I grew up (and the shule I daven at now) also don't
duchen in the "regular" sense when Shabbos and Yom Tov conincide. The
kohanim go up on the bima, say the bracha, and duchening commences.
However, there is no "singing part" - the chazan says the words and the
kohanim repeat them straight through, without delay.
Alan
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Martin Stern <md.stern@...>
Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 11:48:43 +0100
Subject: Re: Kabbalah and Halacha
on 3/6/04 10:29 am, Avi Feldblum at <mljewish@...> wrote:
> I don't know why you need all this, as far as I know there are no
> poskim who disagree that there is a biblical requirement to duchan
> everyday. Most poskim that I know of who deal with the issue reference
> the requirement that the blessings be given in a state of joy (based
> on a statement in the Zohar). Also as a note to an earlier statement
> from Martin Stern about kabbalistic reasons vs halachik practice, I
> think it is far from clear that kabbalistic reasoning has not
> abrogated normative halacha in a number of places. I consider this to
> one of those cases.
If I am not much mistaken, these are all cases of shev ve'al ta'asseh
like not duchaning except on Yom Tov, not wearing tefillin on Chol
Hamoed etc. There is a parallel to the power of Chazal to suspend Torah
laws in similar circumstances e.g. not blowing shofar or taking a lulav
on Shabbat.
The case to which I referred was the possible permissibility of a woman
making a sheitel from her own hair which was raised by Nachman Yaakov
Ziskind in mail-jewish 42 # 83:
"The kabbalistic concepts behind covering women's hair emphasize (as far
as I remember) the evil inflicted behind the emanations from the scalp -
something to the effect that the hair give a yenikah (feeding) to
chitzoniyim (external, i.e. evil, forces) from the holiness in the body
to which they are connected to. Cut the hair, break the connection and
the attractiveness to the evil side goes away."
Thus a positive action would be involved in this case. Whether it is
halachicly forbidden is a matter for decision by a competent Orthodox
rabbi, not me, but it would involve rather different criteria to the
other cases.
Martin Stern
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Art Werschulz <agw@...>
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 09:49:52 -0400
Subject: Re: Marrying someone with your mother's name?
> On a more practical and psychological level, I would think there would
> be some natural inhibition for the husband to have relations with a
> wife whose name was the same as his Mother's. Of course, this should
> also apply to the wife-husband/father and I never heard of that
> 'prohibition'.
Perhaps in the same vein ...
My Mom used to give my wife Estee Lauder perfume on gift-giving
occasions when we were first married. My Mom wears Estee Lauder. I
found this to be somewhat disconcerting. We gently advised my Mom that
this wasn't necessarily the best gift idea in the world. After thinking
about this a bit, Mom agreed with us.
--
Art Werschulz
GCS/M (GAT): d? -p+ c++ l u+(-) e--- m* s n+ h f g+ w+ t++ r- y?
Internet: <agw@...><a href="http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~agw/">WWW</a>
ATTnet: Columbia U. (212) 939-7060, Fordham U. (212) 636-6325
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Ken Bloom <kabloom@...>
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 13:06:08 -0700
Subject: Re: Marrying someone with your mother's name?
Thank you to everyone who pointed out the source for the custom of not
marrying someone with your mother's name. There's one question I asked
on this topic that hasn't been answered: what communities today follow
this custom? (Ashkenazim? Sephardim? Chassidim?)
Thanks.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: <MJGerver@...> (Mike Gerver)
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 18:21:46 EDT
Subject: North, south, left and right (was: Yemenite and Ashkenaz nusach)
Shimon Lebowitz in v42n89, quoting Martin Stern, says,
When I first saw you saying that Arabic used left and right for
North and South, I assumed this was in parallel with ancient (and
Biblical) Jewish usage.
For example, Zecharya 12:6 "ve-achlu `al yamin ve-`al smol et kol
ha`amim" - as the targum translates "min daroma umin tzipuna". Or
Iyov 23:8-9 where all four directions are referred to by their
subjective sides: "... kedem ... ve-achor... smol... yamin" which
Rashi points out refer to East, West, North, and South. (Several
other examples are available).
So, what would make you think that this is based somehow on Mecca?
And how can the directions be relative to Mecca which looks to me
to be pretty far south, or west of most of the Arabic world?
I think what Martin meant is that Damascus is north of Mecca, and Yemen
is south of Mecca, not that using "left" for "north" and "right" for
"south" had anything to do with Mecca. The use of words for "left" and
"right" to mean "north" and "south" is common to all Semitic languages,
so is much older than Islam, or the Tanach.
Mike Gerver
Raanana, Israel
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Chaim Tatel <chaimyt@...>
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 06:14:18 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Not Duchaning on Shabbat
Dani Wassner asked:"Any ideas on where this minhag (to NOT duchen on
Shabbos) came from?"
I remember from when I was a young Kohen, and used to daven in two different
shuls on occasion, there were two minhagim:
1) One shul didn't have duchenen on Shabbos
2) The other had duchenen, but without singing.
The joke at the time was that since the neighborhood didn't have an
Eruv, there was a problem with the Kohanim who couldn't "carry a tune"
on Shabbos.
Funny...........we have an Eruv now, and it doesn't help.
Chaim
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Kenneth G Miller <kennethgmiller@...>
Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2004 11:05:32 -0400
Subject: Re: Not Duchaning on Shabbat
Dani Wassner asked <<< In the shul that I used to daven in ... they had
the custom ... of NOT duchaning on any yom tov that falls on Shab
bat ... Any ideas on where this minhag came from? Seems strange to me...
>>>
A few months ago this came up on another list I belong to (Avodah, at
www.aishdas.org), and someone suggested the following logic:
It is *not* required for a kohen to be ritually pure (i.e., go to the
mikveh) prior to duchaning. Nevertheless, some prided themselves on
doing so. This means that they would either go to the mikveh on Yom Tov
morning prior to davening, or they go on Erev Yom Tov and avoid
relations with their wife on Yom Tov night so that they'll still be pure
in the morning.
Avoiding relations on Yom Tov night is one thing, but when it was
discovered that they were avoiding it on *Shabbos* (when Shabbos was
also Yom Tov), the rabbis (of those communities) decided to cancel
duchaning so that those kohanim (whose priorities were so clearly
misplaced) would have no excuse not to be with their wives on Friday
night.
If the above is accurate, then we might ask why this didn't catch on in
other communities, and why the authorities actually say that this custom
should be abolished, and that we *should* duchan even when Yom Tov falls
on Shabbos. My guess is that this is because in our communities there
are few or no kohanim who would avoid their wives in such circumstances.
Akiva Miller
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Yakir <yakirhd@...>
Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 14:02:43 +0200
Subject: Not Duchaning on Shabbat
Dani Wassner asked"
"In the shul that I used to daven in in Australia, they had the custom
(British in origin, I believe) of NOT duchaning on any yom tov that
falls on Shabbat- making duchaning even rarer than it already is in
chu"l.
Any ideas on where this minhag came from? Seems strange to me..."
If I remember correctly (also from Australia) the reason stems from one
or both of two "problems" associated with Shabbat. The first is the
problem/difficulties associated with the Cohen going to the Mikveh
before duchening, which he should do according to this approach. The
second is the necessity to do so after Friday night (hamavin yavin).
Yakir
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Mark Steiner <marksa@...>
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 17:52:08 +0300
Subject: RE: Tefilah Nusach
Perets Matt wrote:
"In matters of tefilo chasidim frequently adopt the psak of the mechaber..."
This is absolutely true, and I have wondered why for many years.
The bias towards the mechaber (against the Remo) exists even in halakhot
which apparently have nothing to do with the overt controversies between
hassidim and misnagdim--e.g. the role of kabbalah. An example of this
is the answering of "amen" after "barukh hashem hamevorakh le`olam
va`ed," where the hassidim answer "amen" in accordance with the
mechaber. There are many other examples, but this one is so innocuous
and irrelevant to the disputes concerning hassidism that I think a
deeper investigation would be in order.
Mark Steiner
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: <gershon.dubin@...> (Gershon Dubin)
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 13:33:05 -0400
Subject: What "Counts" as Tzedakah
From: Leah S. Gordon <leah@...>
<<I am sure that the posted article [about counting up one's tithe, and
what 'counts' or not] had scholarly sources, but I personally could not
abide considering expenses for adopted children as somehow different
than those for genetic children. What a cruel distinction, to assume
financially that the adopted children are optional charity cases.>>
Charity, yes, for "purposes" of counting as a mitzva. Optional, once
the person has adopted the child, no. IOW, a wonderful thing to do,
even greater than bringing up one's own children.
Gershon
<gershon.dubin@...>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: <Gevaryahu@...> (Gilad J. Gevaryahu)
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 11:31:45 EDT
Subject: Yemenite and Ashkenaz nusach
Shimon Lebowitz (MJv42n89), in his reply to Martin Stern, says:
<Zecharya 12:6 "ve-achlu `al yamin ve-`al smol et kol ha`amim" - as the
targum translates "min daroma umin tzipuna". Or Iyov 23:8-9 where all
four directions are referred to by their subjective sides: "... kedem ...
ve-achor... smol... yamin" which Rashi points out refer to East, West,
North, and South.>
Indeed, to get oneself "Oriented" meant facing the East. East, where the
sun rises, was the natural known direction, pre compass northern
"orientation." When Abraham said to Lot (Gen. 13:9) "Im ha-smol veEmina
ve-im ha-yemin ve-asmila" (if you turn left [=north] I'll turn right
[=south], and if you will turn right I'll turn left) Abraham was saying
this while facing east, the orientation direction. See Onkelos ad. loc.
Gilad J. Gevaryahu
----------------------------------------------------------------------
End of Volume 42 Issue 93